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Mad Poster
Original Poster
#1 Old 14th Apr 2018 at 9:12 PM

This user has the following games installed:

Sims 2, University, Nightlife, Open for Business, Pets, Seasons, Bon Voyage, Free Time, Apartment Life
Default Empty Apartment units don't get filled up.
I think I might be having a real issue, so I'm posting in here instead of in the Stupid/Random Questions thread.

When you move a sim into an apartment, the vanilla game behavior is to spawn Apartment folks to fill up all other empty units on that lot.
I just moved a sim into an apartment, yet no one came to rent the other 3 units. I played with him for almost a whole sim day, and no one showed up. All 3 other units says vacant on their doors.
It usually happens right away, so much that you must pick a unit fast, before any one else picks them all up.
That would be my problem.

Now, what I did (to maybe deserve that):
1- I had forgotten to put back a mod I had, prior to move my very first sim into an apartment.
This mod would be CJ-TownieApartmentResident.

So of course, as soon as I did move a sim into an apartment, the game created some Apartment Townies, to fill it up.
I Then put back Cyjon's mod in my game, thinking now, I'll see Townies filling up my apartments.

2- I decided to get rid of all of them, by killing them and filling up my Cemetery instead.
I went to my GraveKeeper's lot, where there is a cat statue, a sim blender, a fenced in Cow Plant and of course, Rodney's Death Creator.
I teleported one Townie at a time, make him/her selectable using Control This Sim (mod by Dolphin)
then clicked on Rodney's death Creator to choose a death.
I killed 4 sims this way.
But I had more to kill, so I kept going...only to see that some of them would not die. They could not be killed it seems.

3- I decided to then get rid of the remaining apartment townies the game spawned, using Theo's Deleter plugin for SimPE.
Before I did use it, I made a backup of my game.

4- Having Cyjon's mod in the game, I thought I'd see my created Townies, filling up the empty units, now.
I created them all, all new Townies/Adoptees/Dormies etc...for this 'Hood. So I would know/recognize them if they were to come and be tenants.
But no. No one comes, and my empty units remain empty.

I do not have Nysha's mod NyshaMTS_NoTownieApartmentNeighbours in this game, because I DO want my apartments to get filled up.
I do have CJ-RandomApartmentResidents so different Townies will be chosen.

I can try to bring back my backup from before using Theo's deleter and see if my units now gets filled up by my own Townies.
But it won't help with not being able to kill the ones the game created...

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
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Mad Poster
Original Poster
#2 Old 14th Apr 2018 at 11:11 PM Last edited by Rosebine : 15th Apr 2018 at 2:20 AM.
So I tried my back up, and same thing happen. Units stays empty.
Tried another apt building, in case one was fishy...now I do get tenants, but not MY Townies. In spite of all required mods, the game still creates them. I really don't know what to do now.

UPDATE!

It seems to be a building issue rather than anything else. As in...the way I built my apartments!
I would not have thought of this, because once a residential lot turns into an apartment lot without a fuss, without error message, well to me it means all is OK.
I'm not entirely sure yet, but I'll run more tests.
What I did was creating a new 'Hood for testing purposes. This new 'Hood will use my new Townie pool.
I then placed 3 apartment lots, and create a new sim to be moved around...

The first apt I tested, my favorite one...all was OK. All 3 empty units got filled up by my own Townies, 2 YA and one elder.
(because yes, I have a mod that allows for YA tenants)

Then I moved Jam out and into the bin, then moved him into another apt lot I made.
In my current 'Hood, that apt spawned a game created Townie, in spite of all the mods I have.
In the new test 'Hood, no one came...the 1 other unit remained empty.

I moved Jam back to the bin, and moved him into the apt I first noticed the bug, hence my first post.
No one came, again. All 3 empty units stayed empty.

So, one apt works as it should, one does not and one does there but not here.
I went back to the one that does not spawn anyone at all regardless of the 'Hood it is placed in, and made a few renovations.
No improvements. Situation remains the same.

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#3 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 5:55 AM
OK!
Last update, because I am getting quite annoyed with this weird bug I never saw or heard about...

My favorite apt lot works 100% like it should, with the mods I have.
Meaning, empty units gets filled with the proper Townies.
So CJ-TownieApartmentResidents works perfect.

One apt lot does not work, period. No one wants to rent it besides my sim. It will never get filled up no matter what it seems.
I'll get rid of that one.

The last apt I tested now works, but at 50%...
The one empty unit get filled, but the game creates a Townie for it.
So CJ-TownieApartmentResidents does not take effect for that lot.
Which is too weird for my understanding.
I won't be able to play it, unless I want some game created sims. The whole idea behind creating my own Townie pool was to avoid this.
Bummer.

So if anyone could shed some light on this, that'd be great.

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#4 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 7:55 AM
Sorry, apart from hunting for that mod (which I guess you would have done) I can't think what would stop townies. Perhaps something is wrong with its zoning.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#5 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 1:32 PM
OK - here's a bit of information and some mad speculation which may or may not help:

When I built Polgannon, I was concerned to keep the file sizes to a minimum and, as such, I wanted to avoid generating any extra sims when I could. I built Polgannon with playables and no townies at all (in AGS). I also wanted (and did build) apartments. I used the noregen hacks (to stop townie generation) but not the use-townies-as-apartment-dwellers hack (because I had no townies). What I found was this:

Loading an Apartment for the First Time and Generating apartment dwellers
- without the use-townie hack, as you know, the game will generate a new set of apartment dwellers. These are not regular townies, they're a separate group of apartment townies and have different assigned codes which identifies them (to the game) as such.
- However, on loading an apartment lot for the first time, the game does one thing (with the no regen hacks in your Downloads folder, not vanilla) - it makes a landlord. I know this because I was extremely careful and paranoid about the whole process and wanted to prevent too many sim files from generating. I checked the characters folder constantly (and SimPE).
- what triggers the creation of the apartment dwellers is your sim renting an apartment. Once this is done, the apartment dwellers start to generate. They do it one at a time. If you let the apartment lot run for a while, you will see them appear on the portal, one at a time. If you the mouse over the doors, you can see the apartment they have been assigned to. They come at intervals and I've forgotten how long those intervals are now - I was thinking 30 seconds but I don't think it was that long - maybe 15 seconds. Anyway, they don't get generated all at once but one-by-one. The game would lag slightly each time one generated and appeared on the portal and then there'd be a gap for a short while before the next lag and appearance. This went on until the lot filled.
- what I did in Polgannon is put my playables into their apartments and, once they had rented their apartment, paused the game immediately, saved and exited. What this did was leave most of the apartments empty but generated ONE apartment dweller - that was unavoidable because they generated the moment the agreement was signed. The game would have generated more had I let the game run but I didn't - I saved at that point. This was because I wanted to move other playables into the other apartments (nearly all apartments in Polgannon are occupied by playables).
- this is where it starts to get interesting and relevant to you. I would then move a second playable family in and go through the same process. Once the agreement was signed, the first apartment dweller would appear on the lot and it was THE SAME sim as had generated the first time. The game did this every time I moved a family in till the apartment lot was full. So I was able to fill up a, say, four apartment lot with playable families but only generated ONE apartment dweller sim. Given what I was trying to do, this was the best I could get.
- finally, when I did this process with a second apartment lot, I was a bit frustrated that the game would generate a new apartment dweller for that lot instead of using the original one it had made for the first lot. As there are four apartment lots in Polgannon and there are four apartment dwellers - one for each

Behaviour of Apartment Dwellers and Assignation to Lots
So why am I telling you this? One thing I found out is that there seems to be some sort of connection between apartment dwelling sims and apartment lots and I'm not sure what it is. It might be the class-sim thing or it might be more specific. Polgannon took me ages to develop and I tested constantly (with copies obviously). Apartment lots went through lots of iterations and I had to move out moved-in sims several times to make adjustments to the base lot.
- When I did this, I usually deleted the original lot and placed a new copy and then went through the moving in process again
- what was interesting here was that when I moved in the first playable again to the newly adjusted lot, the game served up the SAME apartment dweller sim for that lot - not a new one
- even more interesting was when I did this with two or more lots at once - say I adjusted lot A and lot B, placed both lots back down in the neighbourhood and moved in a family as before, the game would send in the first apartment dweller for the first lot and it was the SAME specific sim for that lot always, it was never one of the others. It didn't matter what order I did it in - A first or B, even if it was a new version of the lot that had never been played. Always the same sim for the same lot. It seemed to be a bit like that 'random' assignment of dormie sims to university dorms who always appear in the same order. If you make a lot of dormies, as I did, you never see the ones at the end of the list living in dorms (unless you had a large number of playable students all living in separate dorms I guess), the game always uses the first available sim from the top of the list. The game can be very unimaginative at times. It was good for Polgannon because I was able to minimise the number of extra sims.

So where does that get us? I'm not surprised your lots which you had already played and had generated apartment dwellers got the same sims back again - that's consistent with what happened in Polgannon. What you should be able to do, which you tried, is kill off the apartment dwellers and try to force the game to use your regular townies. The empty apartments are a puzzle but I'm thinking about those deleted sims. We don't really clearly understand the full ramifications of deleting sims and whether the information they are gone gets communicated properly in all game systems. Using Theo's tool is a fan-method for doing it (based on Pescado's deleted2) - we don't know if they got everything. I'm wondering - and this is the pure mad speculation - whether there's a piece of information somewhere trying to draw in the missing apartment-dwelling sim but, because there's no longer a sim file, there's no sim to draw in. Hmmm - maybe. Sorry. I love speculating on game systems by observing behaviour (I'm often wrong) but it is odd that and there must be some explanation.

Really important question: You did make your apartments in a neighbourhood without any townies and NPCs at all, yes? Because if you didn't the game makes apartment townies on hood generation and they will be used in preference to populate apartments at first no matter what hacks you have.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#6 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 4:22 PM Last edited by Rosebine : 15th Apr 2018 at 4:42 PM.
Quote: Originally posted by joandsarah77
Sorry, apart from hunting for that mod (which I guess you would have done) I can't think what would stop townies. Perhaps something is wrong with its zoning.

I am sorry, what mod? I do have all the mods I need, for the result I'd want.

Quote: Originally posted by maxon
Really important question: You did make your apartments in a neighbourhood without any townies and NPCs at all, yes? Because if you didn't the game makes apartment townies on hood generation and they will be used in preference to populate apartments at first no matter what hacks you have.

My new test 'Hood uses my Townie pool if this is what you are asking?

Thank you for the speculations info.
I would like to add that for my apt lot that works 100%, it was not the same Townies...but it was always 2 ya's and one elder. Taken from my pool. maybe because I tested in different 'Hoods, or maybe because I have a mod by CJ again, to give random Townies.
Using Theo's deleter was something Mootilda was interested about, she asked how to use it and then did. She seemed satisfied with it, as far as I could tell by the thread/posts I read. So I trusted the plugin, obviously.
But what happened to me, happened also in my backup 'Hood, where Theo's plugin was not used, and all game created apt dwellers are still living.
This is very puzzling.

I must figure out what makes a apt block behave as it should that the other ones don't have.
Some of your theories are possible, but I'm not sure about the empty one though.
It behaves the same way regardless of the 'Hood it is in, so regardless of Theo's deleter.

What makes me think it is *how it is built* related is that, I had built 2 complex. Same build, but different color scheme.
One spawned a neighbor, the other one didn't.
I *thought* it was the same built but just recolored, but I might have had a bit of invisible fence here, or something different.
So I used the one that worked, placed another copy and recolor it.(I'll spare you the details, but it took LONG!)
It started to spawn neighbor.
Great! me was thinking...except that it spawns a game created one!
This drives me nuts, as I have a mod to avoid this.
You had no Townies because you made none for Polgannon...but I did made some for Daughnoth, and I want to see them about

So far I get..
1-One complex that spawn Townies from my own Townie pool = 100% working.
2-One complex that spawn a game created apt dweller, in spite of having CJ-TownieApartmentResidents in game = 50% working
3-One complex that stays empty after I move my sim in, as if I had Nysha's NoTownieApartmentNeighbors mod in game = 0% working.

I'm scared to play...

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#7 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 8:29 PM
Quote: Originally posted by maxon
..what I did in Polgannon is put my playables into their apartments and, once they had rented their apartment, paused the game immediately, saved and exited. What this did was leave most of the apartments empty but generated ONE apartment dweller - that was unavoidable because they generated the moment the agreement was signed.

This has not happened in my game this time anyway.

Matt and Martine were both renting a unit, in my apt that used to not work well. (number 2 in my post above, a recolor of a 50% working one..)
Since I have redone that apt, I decided to move back Matt and Martine to the bin.
I then bulldozed the apt, and placed my new copy. ( this new copy should spawn a game created Townie)

I moved Matt back. He signed the agreement, and as soon as this interaction was done, I paused, save then went back to the 'Hood.
No one got created to rent the remaining unit. (there are only 2 units on that apt.)
Then, I moved Martine back too. Played a bit, paused, saved and went back to 'Hood.

When I checked my Character folder, I had the same amount of sims.
I then took a look in SimPE with only the Townies checked in Sim browser. Same thing. Only my own were there.
This time, the game did not created apt dweller.

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
The Great AntiJen
retired moderator
#8 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 9:30 PM
Well, I don't know Rose. That sounds very odd. You're using the townies-as-apartment-dweller hack? If you already have townies in game, I'd expect one of them to turn up once your sim signed the agreement. Did you mouse over the doors - you don't always see the sim right away but you should see one of the doors with a name.

In a vanilla game, not empty when made and without the noregen hacks, the game creates a group of apartment townies when you make the hood so they will start turning up once you load an apartment lot for the first time. I mentioned Polgannon because it was like the opposite of that. I took vigorous steps to avoid any sim file generation and pared it right back to the basics as far as I could. That tells you something I hope about game processes. Little Carping's townie neighbours turn up in aparments though.. Maybe @ChrisHatch would know something about this.

I no longer come over to MTS very often but if you would like to ask me a question then you can find me on tumblr or my own site tflc. TFLC has an archive of all my CC downloads.
I'm here on tumblr and my site, tflc
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#9 Old 15th Apr 2018 at 9:37 PM
I would not have dare to tag him, so thanks for that! hehe
Yes. I do have Cyjon's mod, and another mod by him that makes the game not take the first Townie in the list, so Dwellers get chosen randomly.
And yes, I put my mouse on the door, and it said Vacant, up to the point I paused, saved and went back to the 'Hood.
Which, if I am lucky, simply means that this newer version of my apt building is now working at 100%...because it did not create a apt dweller. Maybe I just didn't give it enough time, to go get one of my own Townie to rent the remaining unit. I can dream!
I noticed, it can take time before someone comes and rent other units. Like you said, it might be 30 seconds, might be less or more.
Even Mister Rod Humble takes his sweet time to arrive at times!

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#10 Old 16th Apr 2018 at 3:00 AM
Quote: Originally posted by Rosebine
I am sorry, what mod?


NoTownieApartmentNeighbours by Nysha. You said you don't have it so I assume that meant you did a search to be sure. Things can slip in unintentionally. I had somehow picked up a default that gave female sims nipples, so with my CC skin they had 4 nipples and looked like a sow! I have no clue how I even got it let alone how it came to be in my download folder, but it did.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#11 Old 16th Apr 2018 at 3:36 AM
Oh! I see. But yeah, I know exactly where this mod is on my computer, and I have it in two places as a .package file, and as a .rar file too.
Scanning my current Downloads folder for it was the first thing I did. And since there is only one apt lot that refuses to spawn neighbors, I know I do not have it in my current game.

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
Needs Coffee
retired moderator
#12 Old 16th Apr 2018 at 6:59 AM
Right, that's what I thought but just checking. That's why my next suggestion was maybe something is going on with the zoning. Did you check that the apartment doors on the correct way around? One time I placed one backwards and took me ages to figure out why one apartment hadn't changed. or maybe try changing the zoning to res or comm and back to apartment.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
~Call me Jo~
Mad Poster
Original Poster
#13 Old 16th Apr 2018 at 12:24 PM
All the obvious reasons have been checked alas.
I have both res and apt version of every apartment I make, just so I do not have to re-zone an apt back into res.
But thank you

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi français !...surtout :0)

Find all my old MTS Uploads, on my SFS, And all new uploads Here . :)
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